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 The O/T thread! 
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Field Plougher
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Post Re: The O/T thread!
Maybe you could send parts you aren't sure about to smiffy to proof read?


January 5th, 2011, 6:13 pm
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Post Re: The O/T thread!
Xmas wrote:
Old-Nail wrote:
I'm several chapters in to writing my book

I hope you're backing it all up regularly Mr Nail :?


Pah! With my luck what could possibly go wrong? :P

Little Lou He has indeed already both offered to, and provided help.
For now though Smiffy has enough on his plate judging from the opening sentence above. Such help as anyone can afford is always very much appreciated, but people do lead busy lives y'know, and one shouldn't impose... and anyway, I've had an epiphany of sorts, it happened on new years eve, and it's left me very confident. 8-)

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January 5th, 2011, 6:25 pm
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Post Re: The O/T thread!
Old-Nail,
I seem to do a lot of reading, probably too much, if finishing a 'Dalziel and Pascoe' at well past 2 o'clock this morning is anything to go by.
Anyway, I've always found the style of your posts on this forum and in your blog to be not only very readable but also very entertaining, so I doubt if you'll have any problem with this latest project. ;)


@ Smiffy,
the question is "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?", in order to look out for those typos which always seem to slip through.
Back in the days when I used have advertising material printed, I lost count of the number of times when a simple error wasn't noticed until 1,000 copies were run off, no matter how many times I'd looked through the original beforehand. :(

Smiffy wrote:

Once you have a semblence of control over the grammar,
The Economist (in spite of it's somewhat dodgy politics)

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January 5th, 2011, 8:51 pm
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Post Re: The O/T thread!
ken wrote:
Old-Nail,
Anyway, I've always found the style of your posts on this forum and in your blog to be not only very readable but also very entertaining, so I doubt if you'll have any problem with this latest project.


I agree!


ken wrote:
I lost count of the number of times when a simple error wasn't noticed until 1,000 copies were run off, no matter how many times I'd looked through the original beforehand. :(


Tell me about it! I used to get the most god-almighty psychological kickings from my overlords for missing, say, a colon on page 23 or whatever. They'd make sure you ate sh*t for days for that sort of thing. Others made worse cockups than mine though, which (although not pretty to witness the dressings down that followed their discovery) was a bit of a relief!

O-N: Here's a Top Tip (which you may already use)! Try to write passages, or chapters, or whatever units you like to you split up your work into, so that you get things kind-of-sort-of close to finished, but don't stress over it. Then leave the piece for a while (or maybe overnight... but not so long that you go cold on the project). Go back to it when you're feeling fresh; you'll see what you've written with a much fairer, and sharper, critical eye. The editing will then be fun.

Here's another: pay attention to planning. Book plans are essential before you start writing. Failing to plan is a bit like driving to Moscow without a map. You might get there, but you'll probably end up going via Georgia, or maybe someone more dodgy. More blandly: it's inefficient.

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January 5th, 2011, 9:55 pm
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Post Re: The O/T thread!
Thanks chaps, the lack of formal education does tend to make one feel inferior though.
I spent my younger life at school wanting to be trained as an Artist, but it was the 1960's and all the art teachers would say back then was to 'express yourself'. So I did, I expressed that:

"I'd like to learn how to draw and paint properly please.

Apparently such ideas were to be frowned upon, phrases such as 'stifled creativity' and other such utter bollocks were bandied about, art had become politicised, and had degenerated accordingly.

Smiffy wrote:
Hi O-N, get hold of a copy of the Economist style guide.

Done! Isn't Ebay simply the best. :D
Smiffy wrote:
Finally, get a good dictionary, and a good thesaurus. Invaluable!


Yep, I already have those. The Oxford English dictionary was the reason for my expulsion from English lessons all those years ago actually. I've always been fascinated with language, and as the lessons were never more than grindingly pedestrian my mind began to wander, so I caused mischief instead.

Eventually I was relegated to a desk of my own right at back of the class as was the sanction back then, but infuriatingly for my English mistress I still came top of the class each exam time, beating her ever so keen and teachers petty (sic) favourites at the front. :lol:

So one day the teacher tells us that she has some marking to do, and that we must pick a book from the bookshelf and read it quietly to allow her to get on with it. At home I used to entertain myself by reading the dictionary (yes, yes, I know :roll: ) when I'd stick a pencil into a random page and then learn the meanings of all the interesting words there, words I may never otherwise have known.

so this day I looked on the shelves and found a large thick dictionary which I took back to my lone desk and began doing my pencil thing, pretty soon I was completely engrossed. Now I don't know if it was my total silence that had aroused her suspicion, or maybe she was just plain bad tempered that day due to having fallen behind with the marking (partying last night Miss? a spot of PMT perhaps?)

A while later she looked up from her marking and quietly asked her favourite little cutie-shoes girly-girl at the front what it was that she was reading? I still remember the title to this day;

"The Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe Miss" She said, in an annoyingly butter wouldn't melt way.

"Old-Nail-you're quiet...what are you reading?" I was asked, I noted that the tone of her voice had changed from all sweetie pie, to loud and accusatory, just by the mere act of addressing me.

"The dictionary Miss"

The whole classroom erupted into laughter, and for an instant I couldn't understand why. The teacher took my innocent answer to be yet another wind up, and what could I say? That day shit, and fan, definitely collided. She went berserk! I'd never seen snot come down a teacher's nose before! :shock:

"You can't read a dictionary boy!"

She bellowed, rolling the 'R' in r-r-r-ead like the Scots do, so as to emphasise the word.

"But, but I can Miss...er, well, I do" I said, in a vain attempt to explain my secret delight in dictionaries.

No chance! Her mind was made up, and I was taking the piss in it. I was ordered out of her lesson with the strict instructions that I wasn't ever to set foot in it again. The year was 1973, and I never again did I set foot in her class, even though I didn't leave that school until '76. On the days with an English lesson in them I simply played truant, and she for her part never reported me missing once in all those years. So ended my education in English.

As a footnote to that story, several years later I developed a taste for crosswords and soon became quite good at them. I seemed able to just look at the gap and the word would just appear in my minds eye, seemingly whether I'd heard of it or not. I'm sure that was as a result of my dictionary readings, as it all goes in the subconscious somewhere doesn't it? I remember I was once in a pub where an electrician friend was stuck, he needed one single word to finish the crossword. After finally giving up he passed me the paper and asked me to see if I could get it. I glanced, and the word immediately popped into my head. It had 8 letters r-h-e-o-s-t-a-t. :lol:

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January 5th, 2011, 10:02 pm
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Post Re: The O/T thread!
"Thanks chaps, the lack of formal education does tend to make one feel inferior though."

Jeepers, Old Nail!!! :lol:

Formal eddoookashun ma botty; your written (and, I suspect, spoken) English is way, way, wa-a-ay above average and makes for bludy good reading. It's entertaining, it's funny, it's clever and it flows.

I can relate to Smiffy's Top Tip above; get the story down as it comes into your head and don't fuss too much about a particular sentence that doesn't flow as well as the rest - just get what's in your mind down on paper. When you come back to it later - reading it as a whole - you'll soon see where small changes can tidy it up a lot. You may up editing out surprising amounts - packing that just ain't necessary and even spoils the flow - and you might also have to add detail as you realise that an important, perhaps pivotal, part of a story (that you took for granted as 'knowing' in your head) is simply missing and the story just doesn't work without it.

Going back over your writing will be enjoyable, every bit as writing it in the first place.

And corrections/improvements will pop into your head at all times - so keep a note pad with you!


January 5th, 2011, 10:33 pm
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Post Re: The O/T thread!
Moab Is My Washpot...

...is the first of Stephen Fry's autobiographies (I got them both for Chrimbo :D ) and is a master-class in honest, poignant and hilarious story-telling. He also had a troubled childhood, and was a complete bastard in class. Hey, you have something in common!

If you like the guy - and I do - I'm sure you'll enjoy the read. And you might even find the detail and way he relates various events in his life quite inspiring.

Anyways, 'Stargazing Live' is on BBC2. It's been a terrific series, really worth watching. Dara O' Brien and Brian Cox introduce. Wonderful. Answered a lot of these Qs wot sit in your head and you always wanted answered. ("Why is the sky at night so dark if there's an infinite number of stars?" "'Cos the universe has been here for a finite amount of time - so the light from the furthest away stars just haven't reached us yet. If they had, the sky at night would be bright.")

Wow...


January 5th, 2011, 10:49 pm
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Post Re: The O/T thread!
DA Actually my spoken English is terrible! Think Gordon Ramsay, mixed with sprinkle of Robert de Niro, on a bed of Peter Kay.

"You fuc*in' talking to me 'owd lad?" :lol:

Smiffy wrote:
Here's another: pay attention to planning. Book plans are essential before you start writing. Failing to plan is a bit like driving to Moscow without a map. You might get there, but you'll probably end up going via Georgia, or maybe someone more dodgy. More blandly: it's inefficient.


Ah yes! I see...attention to planning er... Image QUE?

What's happening at the moment is that I am wandering through my memory palace opening doors along the way and rooting out the contents. These spill out onto the page, or in this case the screen after which I do as you mention and re-read them later, editing as I see fit. I'm struggling with my laptop though, I'm sure I could write it quicker using those kiddie's wooden blocks with letters on the side than in word 2007.

The book itself is a linear progression, so there's no bouncing here and there like there might be in a novel, and I remember all the stuff because I was there, so there's little work needed to keep control of any plot or sub plots. It's a bit when I rebuilt my car, there was bits everywhere, stuff needing doing left right and centre, items to find, items to replace, things to be done in the correct order, but I kept it all in my head, I'm oddly able to do that.

As yet I haven't approached or spoken to any potential publishers who may wish to guide the contents along a different path so as to appeal commercially, so the plan if such it is, is simply to write it, edit it, send a copy off to the main man on my list of celebrities for him to read it (and hopefully write a foreword for it) and see were we go from there.

If this is a bad plan however, involving me taking in Georgia, or god forbid Basingstoke, then any friendly nudges at the tiller are always very welcome.

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January 5th, 2011, 10:50 pm
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Post Re: The O/T thread!
Smiffy,
a footnote, before reluctantly dragging myself back to the VAT & tax returns... ;)
The situation you describe can cut both ways, not very often, but it does happen.

Many years ago, before l decided I couldn't cope with office work any more, I was employed in the Leeds branch of a successful civil engineering consultancy and was chosen to go down the London office to proofread a submission which was being made to the World Bank.
The project was a feasibility study for the Trans African Highway, which had taken a good deal of time and money to prepare, with some of the printing including the covers already finished.

I hadn't been in 14 Queen Anne's Gate very long before I pointed out that the document's front cover, with "The Firm and it's Achievements" plastered in bold lettering across it, contained a basic spelling error.
Things became rather unpleasant after that, as the founder's sons had attended top UK universities as well as completing further studies at Harvard business school and both insisted that I didn't know what I was talking about, what on earth were the people in charge of the Leeds office thinking, etc., etc.
Anyway I completed the job, but on my return from London, I got even more stress from the partners in charge of the Leeds office for daring to argue with the firm's principals ( even when they were in the wrong) .

In a way, they did me a favour, as that probably made up my mind about whether or not to stay in 'professional' employment for much longer. :roll:

ken
( p.s. Now it's got me wondering what they did with those pension contributions I made. )

Smiffy wrote:
Tell me about it! I used to get the most god-almighty psychological kickings from my overlords for missing, say, a colon on page 23 or whatever. They'd make sure you ate sh*t for days for that sort of thing. Others made worse cockups than mine though, which (although not pretty to witness the dressings down that followed their discovery) was a bit of a relief!


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January 5th, 2011, 10:55 pm
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Post Re: The O/T thread!
nail id like 1 signed copy please as soon as its completed :D :D

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January 5th, 2011, 11:19 pm
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