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 425 Advance Weights 
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Joined: August 2nd, 2009, 11:58 am
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Location: Southampton, UK
Post 425 Advance Weights
Hi all,

I wonder if someone with experience of 425cc engines can help me out?
I've been renovating a 425 which has spent many years (decades) in fields/sheds etc. using as little as possible beyond elbow grease. It's been slow and I've learned plenty.
I'm now into the final assembly with a mind to trying to test fire it. I was going to try for a spark this evening but discovered I never sorted any advance weights. I've been scouring my usual parts websites but can only see 602 specific weights. Are the 425 ones different? (I'm thinking they are and this thread (http://www.international2cvfriends.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=5487&hilit=advance+weight+425&start=30) suggests so.) How different? Is there anywhere I can buy some? Is there any way I can modify some 602 weights?
For test firing purposes static timing while be ok but if it runs I'll obviously benefit from an advance curve!

Thanks in advance (!) for any advice you can provide,

Sam

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Yamaha Diversion (XJ600s) 1992 & Puch Maxi S 1977 & VeloSolexes*many 1953-~1970


February 27th, 2015, 12:58 am
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Joined: November 11th, 2010, 4:19 pm
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Post Re: 425 Advance Weights
Hi Sam yes they are different. In the photo in that thread (sorry it's physically on the other computer so I can't bung it up here :roll: ) the advance weight balanced on the cam is a 425 (& M4) one and the one that's actually mounted on the advance mechanism is a 602. The weights on the 602 are bigger and the distance between the 'holes' for the static & moving pins is greater. Putting 602 ones on a 425 advance mech. will simply lock it out @ full advance.
123 do a 6v electronic unit with the 425 curve (ECAS) or poss 2CVGB spares shed has some or someone on here may. Unfortunatly, currently, I've only got the set on the car.

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Mike


February 27th, 2015, 1:30 am
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Location: Southampton, UK
Post Re: 425 Advance Weights
Thanks for the reply citroenboat. I had inspected that photo quite carefully and thought it was much as you describe. I have used a 123 on my D*lly but it went POP! and I've been getting much better with points since so I was hoping to be able to keep mechanical advance and use points assisted ignition. I'm also trying to keep costs at a minimum until I have more confidence that the engine and then car in general will be a goer.
Hopefully I can test at idle on the bench without an advance system.
On a related note, I was thinking that there shouldn't be much reason to stick to 6V. I have a tame electrical wizard who has been warning me of the perils of 6V. He claimed to have fixed my 123 but I never tested it. If I use a 12V coil and supply (generator isn't mounted anyway) then that might work? :?
If anyone out there has a suggestion for 425 ignition bits I'd love to hear about it :)

Cheers guys

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Yamaha Diversion (XJ600s) 1992 & Puch Maxi S 1977 & VeloSolexes*many 1953-~1970


February 27th, 2015, 12:17 pm
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Joined: August 2nd, 2009, 11:58 am
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Post Re: 425 Advance Weights
PS I realise the advance curves are a bit different but this is just the testing change. Can it start, then can it rev up. Will need to be a car for loaded testing at which point it will need a decent curve and 6V.

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February 27th, 2015, 12:56 pm
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Post Re: 425 Advance Weights
Hi Sam mine is running 12v @ the mo, there is a painful & longwinded sort-of account of the change on here somewhere. I ran on 6v for about 3 years with no real hasel exept with indicators being so dim they were invisible in daylight. Starting was a bit iffy too but it still is so not sorted that yet...
I may go back to 6v somewhen but @ the mo it is my everyday car and I'm happy with the better electric performance rather than the Ooo! Ah! originality for that :lol:
The 6v 123 is dual voltage & has all the advance curves on it so can run a 'normal' D*lly too.

I would like to find a 12v bike alternator (most bike ones are crank mounted) that would fit in the dynamo housing on the 425 but not done any research on that yet... There are 'black boxes' that turn 6v into 12v - Ian (Tripyrenees) talks about one in his Traction Avant saga on here, I bought one but stupidly only a 5amp one which won't run the wipers so I can't comment on how good it is....

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Mike


February 27th, 2015, 3:59 pm
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Post Re: 425 Advance Weights
mine is still on 6 volts. no problems but you must be sure all you connectors and especially the ground are clean. Then 6 volts lamps give good lighting. p.s. On the front i did put led lamps in.


February 27th, 2015, 6:17 pm
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Post Re: 425 Advance Weights
Sounds like there is hope for taming the electrons then. For now sparks are flying with my 12V test-bed setup, just not at the right time.
I might have a look for that account Citroenboat. Since I bought the AZ 3 years ago I've had a little experience with 6V having gotten into old mopeds and dim lights when stationary can be unnerving.
I spoke to the2cvshop and they recommended Der Franzose for the advance weights and that tip paid off. So I've now got some on order along with some other odds and sods to make the shipping pay. I'm liking the exchange rate atm, makes this project more affordable than when I bought the car.
I'm going to probe the starter for life while waiting for bits from Germany. It might be needed for testing as the handle really doesn't want to sit in the dog nicely. I can run a 6V moped for a power source.
Thanks again for the advice and confidence, :D

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February 27th, 2015, 8:42 pm
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Post Re: 425 Advance Weights
If you're up my way - Littlehampton - you are welcome to drop in for a coffee & a poke around the 6v/425 bits :D

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Mike


February 28th, 2015, 12:20 am
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Post Re: 425 Advance Weights
Wow, that's kind of you! :)
I've been fairly plodding along with this project but I have time at the moment and have been enjoying more progress. I'm excited to try and fire the engine and I think I now have all I need to do that.
I think I've got the gearbox ok and the body is surprisingly solid but the running gear will likely be the biggest challenge.
I live in Southampton, so not too far from you.

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Yamaha Diversion (XJ600s) 1992 & Puch Maxi S 1977 & VeloSolexes*many 1953-~1970


February 28th, 2015, 1:41 am
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Post Re: 425 Advance Weights
you can test the startermotor on 12 volts the 6 volt moped will no deliver enough power i think.
Disconnect the rest of the electrics as they won't like the 12 volt treatement ;-)
Check if the bronze bearings of the starter are well greased and have a look at the brushes to see if they are clean and still long enough.


March 1st, 2015, 12:41 pm
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