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 2CV shell on AMI 6 rolling chassis 
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Agony Aunt - You have a car problem? Speak to Ken

Joined: March 6th, 2009, 1:40 am
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Post Re: 2CV shell on AMI 6 rolling chassis
Aren't Ami suspension arms made of thicker metal as well?
Acadiane arms certainly are, which would fit with all A series versions with larger diameter suspension springs being made of sterner stuff than the base models.

Using AK350 or AKS400 arms with an Ami chassis, I'd wonder about the risk of the tie rods rubbing on the inside surface of the threaded end tubes which carry the suspension canisters.
There's a very good reason why the tubes on the end of the 60mm OD crosstubes on a 350 or 400 chassis sit so much lower than on an Ami chassis and it's connected to how much offset there is between the centreline of the 'axle' and the knife edges.
At least one supplier of aftermarket chassis fails to recognise this, making a 'one size fits all' version of Ami & AK chassis... :roll:

Pony wrote:
Just go for Ak 350 or early AK 400 rear arms
pony



Image350 & 400 chassis canister angle by slcchassis, on Flickr

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November 20th, 2015, 1:25 am
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Joined: February 17th, 2009, 8:43 pm
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Post Re: 2CV shell on AMI 6 rolling chassis
Project have gone a little slower than I'd like to, but things are going well. Chassis is finished, did some smaller repairs, moved over the handbrake mount for the dish-brakes, from the old chassis, and reinforced the chassis according to advice in this thread and elsewhere on the internet. Everything from the rolling chassis is now being painted and rust-protected. I hope to have it "rolling" again in a week. I will be using all the suspension components from the AMI6, in a stock setup. I have learnt a lot about A-models suspension during this project. I'm amazed about the amount of thought and work, Citroën's engineers put in to this car to be able to make it so easy to work on, and so comfortable to drive, and so practical and reliable. It's a work of art, like the DS, just in a "opposite direction" kind of way.

When it comes to the suspension, I've learnt that not many fully comprehend the differences to it, between different models. I still don't, but have learnt enough to know that one should not change anything, unless one know for a FACT, that it's ok to do so. And though I'm sure most things will "work", only the correct setup, with the correct components, will make the car drive and handle as it should. And then there is the "wear and tear" aspect of it...

Well, I have a couple of questions also! ;)

The original seat belt bracket on later 2CV's, can it be removed if I'm not gonna fit a rear seat? It weighs, according to my sisters horse food scale, 4,5 kilos.
That is 4,5 kilos I could use to something else!
Does it have any needed support function for the body of later years??
This one -> Image

Also, the batteurs are heavy. 5 kilos each. One of the rear ones is stuck and does not function. I will cut the top off, and see if I can fix it. But , I'm thinking of not using the rear ones, it will save 10 kilos! With the heavier Vredestein tyres, I'm not sure the batteurs will function as intended, anyway? Any views on that?

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Five 2CV's, DS 21 ieh Pallas -70, DS 23 h Pallas -75, CX 25 GTi automatic -89, XM 2,0i -90
And a Heinemann Z412 -80


February 12th, 2016, 3:34 pm
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Agony Aunt - You have a car problem? Speak to Ken

Joined: March 6th, 2009, 1:40 am
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Post Re: 2CV shell on AMI 6 rolling chassis
EirikJ,
there shouldn't be any problem with getting rid of the seat belt anchorage bridge.

As regards that batteur which is 'frozen', I'd suggest cutting it close of the bottom but above where the spring coil is wound into the casing.
The photograph below should give you some idea of what's involved.

One of my Dyanes has hydraulic dampers and batteurs on the rear axle, I've driven it without the batteurs fitted with no problems.
Batteurs are most effective on surfaces such as cobblestones (pavé), when they limit the amount of 'pattering' of the wheels.



ImageBatteur in bits by slcchassis, on Flickr

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February 12th, 2016, 4:39 pm
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Firing on two.

Joined: February 17th, 2009, 8:43 pm
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Post Re: 2CV shell on AMI 6 rolling chassis
Thanks a lot Ken! Cutting it close to the bottom makes sense.

The seat belt anchorage bridge is hereby ditched! That's -4 kilos.
And the rear batteurs will probably be put on the shelf, so -10 kilos there! :ugeek:
But I will overhaul and paint them, so they are ready to be put on the car if I want to...

Today I have not only painted, I also put something together for the first time on this project. Felt great!!
New rear wheel cylinders, sorted brakes, and new rear wheel bearings with seal. Rear arms complete, painted and ready to go 8-)

I also have new front wheel bearings with sealings, new tie rod ends, new knife pins, new rubber for the tie rods, new rubber for the steering rod ends, new drive shaft gaiters and a big pile of new parts for the rest of the car. All parts bought in as high quality as I could find. But I only change things that are worn/broken. I have a budget. Besides, I like to reuse old stuff when possible. They made quality stuff back then, compared to much of the repro parts. The re-used parts are dismantled, cleaned, checked, painted and greased/oiled before being put back together again. I want this car to be a solid, technically good car when finished.


So a question; The Quaife differential. It goes right in to the gearbox with no other parts needed? It's quite expensive, where to buy at a good price?

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Vennlig hilsen, Eirik
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Five 2CV's, DS 21 ieh Pallas -70, DS 23 h Pallas -75, CX 25 GTi automatic -89, XM 2,0i -90
And a Heinemann Z412 -80


Last edited by EirikJ on February 16th, 2016, 10:02 am, edited 1 time in total.



February 14th, 2016, 2:56 am
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Post Re: 2CV shell on AMI 6 rolling chassis
Quote:
So a question; The Quaife differential. It goes right in to the gearbox with no other parts needed? It's quite expensive, where to buy at a good price?



Take a look here....
http://www.2cvxtreme.be/index.php/menu-produitsxtreme/prod-barbrous/Produits/21-mt205-diffetentiel-a-glissement-limite-quaife-qdf11h-pour-boite-2cv

These people are "Raiders" so take a look at the whole store/site theres more usable stuff for you...

p.s. no (commercial) connection...

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February 14th, 2016, 11:45 am
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Joined: October 22nd, 2014, 10:59 pm
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Post Re: 2CV shell on AMI 6 rolling chassis
For your frozen batteur try first to get the top screw of and put some oil in there.
Image


February 14th, 2016, 3:59 pm
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Joined: January 11th, 2010, 8:59 pm
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Post Re: 2CV shell on AMI 6 rolling chassis
If you didn't adjust your floors,
Der franzose sells azam 6 floors, these are 2cv floors for an ami 6 chassis

https://www.franzose.de/en/ALLE/Alle/Bo ... /ANR15261/

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March 1st, 2016, 3:21 pm
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Post Re: 2CV shell on AMI 6 rolling chassis
TimVS wrote:
If you didn't adjust your floors,
Der franzose sells azam 6 floors, these are 2cv floors for an ami 6 chassis

https://www.franzose.de/en/ALLE/Alle/Bo ... /ANR15261/


Ecas has them too.


March 1st, 2016, 4:37 pm
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Post Re: 2CV shell on AMI 6 rolling chassis
Thanks for the info about the floors. But I'm going to adapt the original floors, as they are in good condition. And I've just gone from MIG- welding to TIG-welding, and it's a lot of fun ;) Haven't tried it on the paper thin 2CV-floors yet, but I'm sure it'll be fine.

The chassis is now back on it's wheels, a complete rolling chassis again, with engine, gearbox and fueltank!! That was a nice moment.
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The engine got a new original Valeo clutch, and are getting a DG-Nition ignition, and I'm going to try and waterproof it. The DG doesnt have all the small holes in the electronic plate, as the 123 have, so I'm just sealing along the edges of the el.plate, the led-light and where the cables go. Other than that, the engine should be good. Starts easy and runs very well. Fan housing will get some paint later, when mounting the ignition.
The gearbox also runs well with no noise. But it's good practice to check the gearboxes for the normal issues, so I opened it and peened the selector ring, which was still in place and not loose. However, both the nuts behind the back cover was loose, so I torqued them up and peened them.
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During the rebuild, one thing that took a lot of time was the steering. I now know, that the steering is NOT the same on an AMI6 and a 2CV. I should have checked already when I took the AMI apart, but I did not. I just "assumed". That was a mistake. The difference is in the angle of the pinion. When I took the AMI6 steering apart, it was in great shape. Not a single sign of wear anywere! So naturally I wanted to use that. I cleaned it, painted it, and put it together with new grease. A lot of it. Cleaned all threads and put new used suspension arm bearings on it. After torquing it on to the chassis, I started looking at the pinion. And I suddenly was convinced it was not the same as the 2CV.... It didn't look right. After a trip to the barn to find the steering from the 2CV, I discovered that he angle of the AMI6 pinion is steeper. Picture - AMI to the left, 2CV to the right.
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After a few necessary words had been spoken, I shut up, had a beer, and started working on the steering from the 2CV. It was worn. So was all the other three 2CV-steerings I had. Luckily, They were not worn exactly the same, so I managed to get one good one from the four. I had to paint again, and at the same time did the grease nipples by the pinion and the sliding thing between the steering rods. It turned out great, and should give many many years of trouble free steering. I guess the AMI6 is the same as the Mehari? They both have the steering wheel very "flat".
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One other problem was the securing ring for one of the rear wheel bearings. Someone back in time had used a hammer and a rod to dismount/mount the rings. So they were a bit damaged. I had not ordered new ones, because "reproduction sucks"... Probably a mistake, because one of the rings just wont go into the drum again. It goes halv way in, then starts to "pinch"? I cant find any faults on the threads, so I think the ring is out of shape. Ordered new rings, hope that will solve the problem.

The "batteur" that was stuck, I think will be an easy fix. I cut it open, but to get the piston out of the cylinder, I had to cut a hole in the top, to get some proper tools to use on the piston. A BIG hammer was needed. There was oil in it, and no sign of rust. 48 years old, but clean as a whistle inside. I think what have happened is, that it got hit by something. If something hit it, the mounting which is on the middle of the cylinder, may distort the cylinder and the piston will stick in the bore. I'm positive that's what's happened here, even though there are no signs of external damage. Not sure what's the best method of correcting the bore. Maybe just gentle sanding at the spot where it sticks. Then it's just a matter of welding it back together and it should be good as new. Sort of....
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All four suspension arms are from the AMI6, but the cross members are 2CV. In the front because of the steering issue, and at the back because the car will get LHM and 2CV-brake piping.
Image


So far, I have already spent a lot of hours. Long days in the garage. The cleaning, repairing and painting part of it can be a bit boring and time consuming. But the "taking the car apart" bit, and "putting the car together" bit are great fun :D

Next; The Body

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Vennlig hilsen, Eirik
Image
Five 2CV's, DS 21 ieh Pallas -70, DS 23 h Pallas -75, CX 25 GTi automatic -89, XM 2,0i -90
And a Heinemann Z412 -80


March 2nd, 2016, 8:06 pm
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Post Re: 2CV shell on AMI 6 rolling chassis
Looking very nice, I didn't know Ami 6 has diffrent angle... You could keep the Ami 6 steering rack and use a Ami 8 / mehari steering tube with but only wit 1 joint.. It is better to have a joint in there anyway. When the chassis or body is out of shape (body or chassis knackered) you can still steer the car.. With a standard steering tube you can't steer the car.....

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March 2nd, 2016, 8:54 pm
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